Yesterday featured a look at the roundtable interview I participated in with Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy star Colin Firth. My sit-down with the film’s director, Tomas Alfredson, and co-writer, Peter Straughn will be published on Friday. Today brings the question-and-answer segment focused on Gary Oldman, the firm, reserved core of the film’s ensemble.
Oldman plays George Smiley, perhaps the character most iconically associated with spy novelist John le Carré, who is responsible for the film’s 1974 source material. Oldman has, rather infamously (and sadly), never been formally recognized by the Academy Awards, and many are hoping that his layered turn as Smiley could break the barrier for him. However, the thing is, interestingly enough, that this quiet, methodical performance is something that the Academy rarely attaches themselves to, so the mere fact that he’s in firm contention for a Best Actor nomination – indeed, most pundits currently have him in their top five in the field – is a testament to how badly people want to see this guy earn a nomination.
Topics of conversation in the interview below include the actor’s hilariously good-natured roast of James Bond, his humble recollection of meeting Michael Fassbender for the first time (at this year’s Governors Awards), as well as, of course, a brief look ahead to Christopher Nolan‘s The Dark Knight Rises.
Let’s start off with the same question that we asked the other guys. How intimidating was it going into this knowing about this landmark performance from Alec Guinness that people are inevitably going to [compare you to]?
Gary Oldman: Terrifying, in a word. [Laughs.] Because [Guinness] became the face of George for generations, and he’s very much part of the establishment of the British thespian world. His shadow is cast – it’s large. The ghost of that performance was always there. So it wasn’t like [I said “yes” to this project] right away. I kind of had to think about it because those inevitable comparisons are there. I played a trick with my head, I think. What I did was I approached it like an actor would a classical part, and there’s room for interpretation. You know, there have been other Hamlets, other Romeos, other King Lears – do a Hamlet and you’ll be compared to all of those other people that have played it before. So I just thought it’s time for a reinterpretation. And now they’ve put me on the cover of the book. [Laughs.] I’m the face of George now.
How would you describe your interpretation of Smiley from a psychological point of view? How is he different psychologically from, say, the book, or other portrayals?
Well, James Mason has played him. Denholm Elliott played him. Anthony Hopkins has played him. I mean, there have been a few Smileys. I think what I got from the book; there’s a bit of a sadist to George. If anything, Guinness was a little more huggable than mine. [Smiley] can [actually] be quite mean, he can be quite cruel, because he has to tickle people. There was a phrase in the book that was the key into him, that unlocked the door for me. Anne, [Smiley’s] wife, describes George as a “swift” – a creature that can regulate his own body temperature to that of the room and the situation he’s in. Almost like a chameleon. Where you’re in a room and you just blend into the furniture, the walls. And that’s why he’s considered to be this sort of master spy. I mean, we even discussed things like, would he wear cufflinks, would he wear a tiepin? And we decided no – those are all the things that you would remember someone by. Another spy would remember [that stuff]. [He needed to] be invisible. And that passage, to me, was where the stillness comes from.
Was it appealing to you to play a spy that’s so [reliant] on his brains and skill as opposed to technology?
Well, it’s an interesting period because it’s right on the cusp of technology, but it’s still an analog world. It’s still files. The Internet and the phones and these cameras have really completely changed the face of espionage – changed the way they do things. I admire Tomas for taking this and not wanting to, in any way, feel the need to compete with The Bourne Identity or the Bond movies. When I saw the movie, it was like watching a lava lamp. The pace of the movie is like snow falling. And I really admire that. You notice sounds. And it’s not that they’re particularly over-amped up. It’s that they have so much silence around them – that when you hear them, you notice them. Movies assault you now. There’s too many movies [where] the cuts are too quick, the sound is pumped-up. These movies you go and see – even comedy, like The Hangover – and they come at you. And I think it’s nice to see a quiet thriller. It’s refreshing. People are getting a little tired of all of that. I mean, what the f*ck is 3-D about? [Laughs.]
Much of your performance was in your eyes, your body posture. How much of a challenge was it to get that performance across in that way?
Well, you have the holy grail. You have the book. And everything you want to know about how to play George is in the book. That comment by Anne in the book – that was a beginning for me. But you have Tomas who is the barometer of what you’re doing. There were times when I was doing too little. So you have to trust the director when he’d say, “we need a little more there, we’re not quite getting it.” I’ve waited thirty years to play this part. Not this part, you know, but it’s – you are at the mercy of not only the roles that are available, [but also] all of [the other] variables. Sometimes there are roles you would like to play that they give to other people. Sometimes there are roles you would like to play but you have to have a holiday with the kids.
There are all those things when it comes in and it’s not convenient. And you don’t get offered everything. But you’re also at the mercy of the imagination of the people who are casting you. Early on in my career, I was very fortunate because it just so happened that I played Sid Vicious and then I played Joe Orton. I played them back-to-back. And I didn’t engineer it, it just kind of happened like that. And now, you’ve got to admire someone like Chris Nolan – instead of giving me the role of the villain, he gave me the role of [Gordon]. And then I’ve worked with Luc Besson, and those are two kind of very comic-book characters. [But] Oswald’s a quiet character, Oswald’s subtle. If you think of cousins to Smiley, in that sense, there have been a few. But directors see you do one thing and they want you to keep doing that.
So, was it challenging to make that transition?
Well, that’s the fun of it. First of all, that’s the fun of acting. I like to think of it. When I was growing up [in the 60s], you saw Peter Sellers and The Telegoons and all of those. And [even] Guinness wasn’t always a subtle actor. He’s played his fair share of…he’s worn some funny noses and wigs over the years, too. So, it’s like we’re all in a chain. It’s like links in a chain and it passes through. Now you’ve got Benedict Cumberbach; in this movie, he’s just fabulous. Fabulous actor. You’ve got Tom Hardy, you’ve got people like Michael Fassbender. You’ve got these younger actors of a different generation coming. And we’re all sort of part of it.
What about your status as being this revered actor [who young actors look to] for encouragement or enlightenment? Is it something you ever expected to happen?
[It’s been] a wonderful, unexpected thing. I [actually] met Michael Fassbender for the first time the other night [at the Governors Awards], and he just said to me, ‘You’re why I’m doing this.’ I’m [not saying] I walk around on air [Laughs] but those are nice things to hear, especially from people who one admires, who I look at and think he’s wonderful. It’s always very flattering. It’s all been a little bit of talent and a little bit of luck. Careers are funny things.
Do you think you would make a good spy now since you’ve made the whole transformation? [Laughs.] Could many actors make great spies?
I’m too famous. [Laughs.] You know, Bond always [struck me] as a weird guy. He announces who he is everywhere he goes. ‘Mr. Bond is over there. Kill him.’ ‘How do you know it’s Bond?’ ‘Because he just told me.’ [Laughs.] You know, that’s weird to me. ‘Who is that handsome-looking guy who’s pulled up in an Aston Martin?’ ‘It’s the spy.’ [Laughs.] I never could get my head around that. I enjoyed it. But it’s not realistic. Tinker, Tailor is, I think, more [realistic]. You see the casualties of the job.
Have you lost some of your quiet time since you’ve become more famous? Can you hide anymore? [Laughs.]
I can hide less in that sense. And it’s just started to happen. I’ve just noticed it. Because I go everywhere and, to this day, I don’t have a publicist. I go to the supermarket and I go with my kids – everywhere. I go to the doctor and I wait in the waiting room. I don’t have a sort of side door that lets me in. [Laughs.] I think people are quite surprised that they see me [shopping]. But I used to be able to hide more, so it might be time to get me something. What does Leonardo [DiCaprio] wear? He wears a baseball cap?
Quickly, what do you think will surprise people the most about The Dark Knight Rises? And is there anything you want to say about working with Tom [Hardy] on that?
I have very little to do with Tom on this one, actually. The story – I think [Nolan] has brought the whole trilogy perfectly [to a close]. Well, not to a close – who knows? I don’t think Chris will make another one. Maybe. But the story is great and I think it’s epic. I don’t think Chris would’ve…he’s smart enough and classy enough, I think, not to make a third one just for the sake of making it. He was really concerned with giving you a great story, so I think that’s what I’m excited about.
For people of a new generation coming along that will maybe see this movie and say [that you are amazing], what would you suggest to them to go out and see of your work?
There’s State of Grace. But a piece of work I’m particularly proud of that no one has ever really seen – because it went straight to DVD – was a little film called Nobody’s Baby. It’s a comedy.
Tinker, Tailor, Soldier, Spy hits limited theaters December 9th.